Author Topic: Promenade FARCE..!!!!  (Read 2436 times)

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Promenade FARCE..!!!!
« on: May 13, 2013, 01:35:48 PM »
The Gazette is asking readers for their input after Blackpool Council and at great expense, appear to of messed up the Blackpool Promenade..!

They are asking for help to solve the bottleneck problems, my advise to them..revert back to the 4 lanes as it was, it worked and traffic flowed..If its NOT broken then don't fix it.!!!  :cursing: :cursing: :cursing: :cursing:

Here are the choices..and more expense..!!!

Five possible options for the future of Blackpool Promenade are exclusively revealed by The Gazette today after town hall chiefs agreed to a full-scale review of the layout which has been blamed for causing congestion.

The controversial ‘shared space’ design between New Bonny Street and North Pier could be ditched in favour of a return to the original four-lane carriageway.

Other alternatives could be to retain two lanes but resurface the carriageway, install a new raised kerb and adopt different types of crossing points.

The cost of any work, which is up to £2.7m, will be met from existing council funds, while depending on the final option chosen, it could mean the Prom being closed for more than eight months.

Residents are now being consulted on the options before councillors make a decision this summer.

OPTION 1 – No changes.

Repairs carried out as and when required to block work carriageway surface.

The zebra crossing which was removed earlier this year would not be reinstalled.

Cost: none

Length of closure: none.

OPTION 2 – The block work carriageway and lay-bys would be replaced with asphalt. 
Three crossings would be required to allow people to cross safely. 
A raised kerbline would also be introduced at the edge of the footway.

Cost: £1m - £1.2m

Length of closure: 15 weeks.

OPTION 3a – The layout would remain a single lane in each direction with pedestrian refuges installed at up to six key points to help people cross the road.
It also has right turn facilities and lay-bys.

Asphalt would also replace the current blockwork and a raised kerbline would be introduced at the edge of the footway.

Cost: £800,000 to £925,000

Closure: 15 weeks.

OPTION 3b – As option 3a but with an extended central reservation rather than smaller pedestrian refuges.

Cost: £900,000 to £1.05m

Closure: 15 weeks.

OPTION 4 – Change the layout to provide two lanes in each direction, widening the carriageway.
Replace block work with asphalt and install crossings at all junctions.
Guard rails would need to be reintroduced for pedestrian safety reasons.

Cost: £2.3m - £2.7m

Closure: 35 weeks.

But no work would begin until the end of the Illuminations at the earliest.

There has been widespread discontent following the opening of the ‘shared space’ Promenade in June 2011 as part of the £14m new Tower Festival Headland.

Traffic has regularly backed up while fears have been raised about pedestrian safety.

Areas of the new block work carriageway have also had to be repaired after cracking under the weight of traffic.

However figures show fewer people have been injured in traffic accidents on the Prom since the new design was unveiled.

Figures show between 2008 and 2010, there were 35 people injured in accidents on the Central Promenade, compared to four in 2012 which was the first full year of the ‘shared space’ design.

The five proposals will be showcased at St John’s Business Centre at St John’s Church, Cedar Square, on Thursday and Friday, and people can also take part in an online survey.

Council leader Coun Simon Blackburn has pledged to listen to what the public wants on the issue.

The exhibitions at St John’s take place on Thursday and Friday between 10am until 7pm.

Consultation closes on May 31. To take part in the online survey, visit


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Re: Promenade FARCE..!!!!
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2013, 03:12:50 AM »
Putting the prom back to four lanes is and forever will be a fools errand. From a traffic engineering p.o.v it makes very little difference in terms of capacity.

One major notable difference though is the MASSIVE fall in pedestrian injury accidents. The old layout was averaging one serious injury accident once every 3 months. As I understand it now, that rate has fallen to something like one every 12 months.

Whichever way you look at it, that is one massively successful safety scheme if nothing else. Certainly with that rate of return in terms of casualty reduction, it is very enviable and I would say if in my 15 years as a traffic engineer if any of my schemes came out with a ratio such as that, I would retire tomorrow, as it would never be improved upon.

With regard to the traffic congestion issue though, it is not so much that the new layout makes it worse, as it does not. All that has happened is that the dynamic has changed. I moved to Blackpool in 2008 and I have spent the same amount of time queued on the prom under the old layout as I have the new; all that has changed is how it appears to the untrained eye.

And where BBC is going wrong is that they are being far too reactionary. They should, in theory, be able to model the traffic behaviour before and after and I would bet good money that actual journey times are not that much different between the old layout and the new.

Education is that which remains after you have forgotten everything else you have been taught.


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Re: Promenade FARCE..!!!!
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2013, 07:46:27 AM »
Blackpool Gazette - Report says "leave prom as it is".

I note that the usual keyboard warriors are out in force on this article, inflamed by ill-informed opinion.

To put it another way, any professional traffic engineer (of which Arup have many, who are much better at their jobs than I) would be fully aware of the political nature of these issues over the promenade and the way it has changed traffic flows and the way it "appears" to flow and the politically motivated outcry from some quarters.

That report will, I am certain, be absolutely water-tight in its basis, the facts used and the outcomes that form the the recommendations. Yes, traffic models can be fudged to a certain degree, but such fudges can also generally be spotted very easily quite often just by comparing the raw input data with whatever is in the model itself.

No, I would not have designed the promenade in the way it has been, but that doesnt necessarily mean it is wrong. Far from it. In my own version I would have kept it single lane, but with a larger median as two physically separate traffic streams with perhaps planting in the middle and better opportunities to cross each direction independently rather than the zebra crossings.

Changing the promenade to single carriagway hasnt reduced the overall capacity of the network in the slightest, if you take it as a view from say Gynn Square to Lytham Rd. All it has done is change the way traffic behaves on that network and moved the queues of traffic that used to form outside the Tower, so that they are now either side of New Bonny St and Talbot Square. It is this change in appearance that people are seeing and assuming things are worse.

I used to live in Foxhall and I know exactly what traffic flow was like and it is not that much different now. What has not been stated in ANY of the media articles is what the end-to-end journey times are, before and after. This could be easily determined from modelling and I would hope that it would be contained in a report somewhere; if it isnt, then its not all that difficult to determine anyway, particularly with microsimulation models.

But from my own point of view, given the changes proposed to Central Drive as well as what this report recommends is that the councillors now grow a bit of a spine and make some tougher decisions. My own recommendations would be:

  • Closure of New Bonny St, or at least make it one way away from the Promenade
  • Make Chapel St two way from Central Drive
  • Split the zebra crossings up in to two separate crossings in each direction, adjusting the carriageway width to suit
  • Adjust the layout in places to allow more informal crossing opportunities
  • Change the street lighting and remove some of the street clutter which has crept in
  • Remove the signals at Talbot Square and make the junction more like this example in Poynton
  • Develop an origin/destination survey to find out WHY people are using the promenade as a North/South route and develop better internal north south avoiding routes around the town centre, demolishing property if needs be. Sign the councillors up to it, set it as policy and then get to it.
Education is that which remains after you have forgotten everything else you have been taught.


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Re: Promenade FARCE..!!!!
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2013, 03:48:15 PM »
Excellent posts Slacker.
100 million has been spent on the tramway.
Time to start getting traffic out of the town.
Solution, park and ride. Extend tramway to Pontins and create a transport hub and parking.
Site has Rail (Squires Gate Station), Bus and possible tram.
Rather than having a tram to North Station, which would be very expensive, have a link using the route through Central Car Park, Seasiders Way, BFC, to South Station. (Bus Transport Hub and parking)  Non pedestrian sections, so could be a fast section.
Double the track or 2 passing loops on the South Fylde Rail Line. Increase from 1 to up to 3 trains per hour to Pleasure Beach - Lytham St Annes - Preston.
Congestion charge (that would go down like a lead balloon) applied to Tower area of the Prom/ Town?? - make good money during the illuminations.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2013, 03:50:09 PM by Clive »


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Re: Promenade FARCE..!!!!
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2013, 01:57:58 PM »
You can download the report produced from the link below

Turning off the lights at New Bonny St and Talbot Rd seems to have made a small difference. Although turning onto the Prom from New Bonny St can be a bit of a pain depending on the person at the front of the queue. It will be interesting to see how this works on a Friday/Saturday night during the Illuminations when traffic can queue down Talbot Rd to Dickson Rd, and also down New Bonny St onto Central Drive towards the King Edward Pub. So with the planned change to Central Drive from Reads Ave to Albert Rd that will be a no go area.

I'm still avoiding town during the day during the season. The couple of times I used the Prom during the early afternoon last week it took me about 6 minutes going via the Prom to go from home (by the airport entrance) to just after Foxhall Sq. It then took 5 mins to get from there to the Metropole. The return journey was quicker on Prom section